College enrollment is dropping both nationally and in the state of Massachusetts, and community college are especially struggling.

According to the National Clearinghouse Research Center, enrollment in the two-year schools dropped more than 3% across the country last year compared to 2017.

The state’s Department of Higher Education estimates those drop-offs were even steeper in Massachusetts — with enrollment dipping more than 4%.

Michael Horn, a higher education writer for the Lexington-based Christensen Institute, joined WBUR’s Morning Edition host Bob Oakes to talk about what’s causing the downturn.